Talk: A Rose by Any Other Name (comic story)

Inclusion

Can we add a NOTDWU label to this page? When the story features the Doctor speed dating a Weeping Angel (that is able to talk), Cyberman and a Blowfish, somehow I don't think it's meant to be taken seriously. Notsimonpegg ☎ 16:12, July 31, 2015 (UTC)

This kind of thing is covered over at Board:Inclusion debates, so if you'd like to argue against the inclusion of this story, you can start a thread over at the board. Thanks! Shambala108 ☎ 16:25, July 31, 2015 (UTC)

For those not familiar with the debate, we found that comics like ARbAON are valid sources on this wikia. OS25 (talk to me, baby.) 19:16, October 24, 2015 (UTC)

Something I still disagree with but hey I don't run the site, if the Tenth Doctor having a barbecue with K9 and a cat is classed as valid to somebody then whatever Notsimonpegg ☎ 03:10, October 25, 2015 (UTC)

This is an issue again where the difference between something being 'canon' and 'valid' must be noted. On this site, we deem that what the authors intended these stories to be in production is far more important than how silly we think they are.

Also these comics are great. OS25 (talk to me, baby.) 05:31, October 25, 2015 (UTC)

Well that's as may be, but I think the exact point User:Notsimonpegg was making is precisely that it was clearly NOT intended to be set in the DWU. 86.152.171.188^{talk to me} 18:17, April 9, 2018 (UTC)

Superlative

I've been doing quite a bit of private research on the Who franchise, and I do believe the statement I added that ARBAON is the longest-running single story in the history of the franchise stands. They didn't even change titles over the 22 issues the story ran. 23skidoo ☎ 16:40, May 26, 2016 (UTC)

Parody

This story is cleary a joke, I mean look at the smallest planet us the universe page. - Denchen: Lord of Invalidness ☎ 23:47, November 26, 2016 (UTC)

Clear parody

What would be the reasons to deem this story parodic, in the same domain as, say, the Dalek comic story The Invasion of Bash Street or the Tenth Doctor scene from Family Guy? I just found out that all the stuff from this story is on the biography section in the Tenth Doctor and Rose Tyler pages. It seems pretty ridiculous and completely out of place down there. I'm surprised that I even have to write this, who on Earth would say that this is a story with a straightforward plot that describes what really happened for the Doctor after Doomsday? I think it's clearly impossible to claim that the story was written in the same ambiance as the TV series or its companion story The Weeping Angels of Mons. Dmitriy Volfson ☎ 13:48, April 20, 2019 (UTC)

Unfortunately nothing is gonna change on this front. I don’t like it either, but a validity debate was held and the wiki came to the consensus that these backup strips are valid. This was resolved fairly recently so there’s no real chance of a do-over. There will have been people who wanted them in and those who wanted them out but at the end of the day there was a consensus reached that they fit with the criteria enough to stay, so that’s basically it. SarahJaneFan ☎ 14:06, April 20, 2019 (UTC)

You two, see my response to User:Zerinza below. And let this please be the last complaint on this topic on this talk page unless (by some twist of fate) new facts surface. Scrooge MacDuck ☎ 20:24, 19 December 2020 (UTC)

Legends and Memory Beta

The inclusion of these is the single greatest argument I have ever seen for a strict division between what's been shown on television (or YouTube) and all the secondary sources. Wookieepedia did it, Star Trek's Memory Alpha did it, and I hope to god this wiki eventually does it too. Zerinza ☎ 19:30, 19 December 2020 (UTC)

I strongly suggest that you go read T:VALID for why this Wiki shall not ever be doing that.

Epsilon 📯 📂

19:34, 19 December 2020 (UTC)

Indeed. Please everybody familiarise yourselves with T:CANON, T:VALID, T:NPOV and Canon. Firstly for why we shall never, ever do anything so foolish and (frankly) offensive as describe non-televised sources as being "secondary" to the TV series. I understand the argument for why some people might want to say A Rose by Any Other Name shouldn't be put on the same level as Doomsday — but there is absolutely no valid reasons why, say, The Weeping Angels of Mons shouldn't be as "canonical" as anything.

However, all this light(?) reading will also inform you that we don't actually ask that anyone consider everything valid to be "canon" in their personal headcanon. We merely neutrally report what everybody with the right to do so has said about the DWU while meaning it. Rachael Smith has told us that as far as she and her editors were concerned, A Rose by Any Other Name takes place in the DWU — so that is what we report. If you have a problem with that, your disagreement is with Smith, not with us. User:Dmitriy Volfson asks higher on this page "who on Earth would say that this is a story with a straightforward plot that describes what really happened for the Doctor after Doomsday". Well, the author does, for one. But, mind you, so do I, and I know User:SOTO does as well. Your preferred kind of DW story isn't universal — there is no reason people who want Doctor Who to be a Serious Drama should feel superior to those who prefer Doctor Who to be comedic first and foremost.

Dmitriy also says that "it's clearly impossible to claim that the story was written in the same ambiance as the TV series or its companion story". But the thing is, no one's claiming that. We are simply claiming that those three sets of narratives are intended to take place in the same broader fictional universe. "Ambience" has nothing to do with being in the same universe or not; Torchwood has a markedly different ambience/approach from The Sarah Jane Adventures, and neither's approach is very much like that of An Unearthly Child at all, to say nothing of the TV Comic.

I recommend that, if you are still not convinced, you read through the post which ruled The Curse of Fatal Death valid, which deconstructs this argument at length in the context of explaining why Curse is also a valid source on this Wiki. Scrooge MacDuck ☎ 20:24, 19 December 2020 (UTC)

"longest-running officially licensed serialised story in franchise history"

Wouldn't this story be beaten (twice) by PROSE: Doctor Who and the Daleks? Cookieboy 2005 ☎ 11:52, 31 August 2022 (UTC)

I think it would. Bongo50 ☎ 12:45, 31 August 2022 (UTC)

Yeah that's the problem when people use superlatives to describe something. They never go back to change it when it's no longer the "only" or the "longest" or whatever. Shambala108 ☎ 15:08, 31 August 2022 (UTC)

Why would it? Doctor Who and the Daleks had more parts (50) but wasn't it released in a single batch in ~August 1964, rather than being paced out over 2 years? – n8 (☎) 15:23, 31 August 2022 (UTC)

I think it depends on how you look at the statement. I viewed it as discussing the number of parts but I guess it could be discussing the length of time it was released over. I think, whether it is right or wrong, the statement needs to be made clearer. Bongo50 ☎ 16:13, 31 August 2022 (UTC)